Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

Skinnable — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:14 GMT

It might also be worth mentioning, that before the attunements for SSC and The Eye were removed, you needed to kill Nightbane as part of the SSC attunement.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

Indelible — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:13 GMT

I would mention that if I were discussing that issue. Interestingly, they removed the attunement because people felt that it was ridiculous to ask for attunements to every raid dungeon and the decision had nothing to do with Karazhan.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

matticus — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:12 GMT

Naxx is now 10? Aww, I wanted to try it in 25 man mode.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

Skinnable — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:11 GMT

Sheesh, you seem to have it out for me.
I know the reasoning behind the removal, all I was saying is that it might have been yet another mistake to initially include part of the keying process for the first tier 5 instance inside the entry level dungeon. As you said, what was supposed to be the ZG of 70. Its not 100% in tie with the topic, but it is somewhat related.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

Kody — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:10 GMT

I honestly didn't have a problem with Nightbane being required for SSC. The major issue I had was with TK attunement, which required a number of Heroic instance completions, which required a bunch of rep grinds, etc.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

NeosliveR — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:09 GMT

Naxxramas is being retuned for 25man and and according to them they are now developing parralel progression with 10 and 25man in wotlk (ie having tier x 10man and 25man then tier x+1 10man/25man with probably only the amount of loot generated changed) instead of having 10man instance being a first step into the raiding game.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

Kody — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:08 GMT

Yeah last I remember from Blizzcon, Naxxramas will still be the "big boys" raid zone with a 25 person cap.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

Indelible — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:07 GMT

Pssh - I read we were going to get exciting new battlegrounds in TBC but that never happened :o Blizz lie allll the time :o They lied to me and broke my e-heart :-(

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

helraider — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:06 GMT

You seem to make a big deal of the 2x small raid = big raid, but this assumes that every member is online for all raids, while in my experience nobody achieves a perfect 100% raid attendance over say, 2 months.

and by the time people have 25 man raid ready, then for the last karazhan raids to gear up last people you can safely state that 5 man at least will have gotten all their gear from karazhan.

just my 2 cents, and if you know an example of a closed guild of 25 people who ALL can raid 100% of the time, and can complete the raid I'd like to congratulate them.

Karazhan and Zul'Aman - A Fixed Mistake?

angelrock — Fri, 26 Oct 2007 00:22:05 GMT

Helraider,

The biggest problem with want you say is you do want 25 dedicated raiders for the 25 mans. To sit 5 down and say we may or may not cycle you in in Kara will not work. They came to raid and will move to another guild where they can.
This pushes you to have to have 3 runs in what was a very class specific instance to keep your main raiders happy. This leaves five who can be benched later but causes some weeks runs to fail because of what you said, not everyone can make every run.
On my server ( a high population server that started in beta wow) we have had many old guilds give up from the logistic nightmares. They have ended up disbanding. Blizzard has admitted Kara was a total mistake and has made nerfed Kara then made ZA as a follow up for guilds who cannot pull the numbers for 25 mans.
Having ran ZA with a well geared T5-T6 group I have found it will be tough for guilds just out of Kara which will make future drama in the forums which is unfortunate.